I'm pooped (but that's not enough so I have to add words to make this post title long enough)

That's all. Just pooped. Anyone else pooped?

I like saying poop.

Haha. Poop.

Also, not yet, but I've got 2 days left in the semester before finals and several papers that need to be written. So ask again on Saturday.

Oh wait... we were talking about something else!

Nathan James Norman wrote:

Oh wait... we were talking about something else!

SOMEbody has little ones in the house!

I'm pooped.
I'm the kind of pooped you get when terms like "dreams" and "goals" are a thing of the past.
I'm pooped the way you are when you start painting your Warhammer miniatures and are sure that they are going to look awesome, but they turn out looking like you just slapped a lot of messy paint on them.
I'm pooped like when you sign up for a 30 week small-group at church, only to realize it is remedial at best, and applies Bible verses in a suspect manner. (week 3 tonight, woo hoo )
I'm pooped like I need to drop 30 lbs and tend to break out in a panic attack when I exercise.
I'm pooped, and I'm pooped of being pooped.
Oh poop.

mikel.withers wrote:I'm pooped.
I'm the kind of pooped you get when terms like "dreams" and "goals" are a thing of the past.
I'm pooped the way you are when you start painting your Warhammer miniatures and are sure that they are going to look awesome, but they turn out looking like you just slapped a lot of messy paint on them.
I'm pooped like when you sign up for a 30 week small-group at church, only to realize it is remedial at best, and applies Bible verses in a suspect manner. (week 3 tonight, woo hoo   )
I'm pooped like I need to drop 30 lbs and tend to break out in a panic attack when I exercise.
I'm pooped, and I'm pooped of being pooped.
Oh poop.

Now THAT is some poopiness!!

30 week small group commitment?? Yikes! Do they have that in writing? Is there any way you can respectfully back out of it? Is this at someone's home, or the church? Is someone leading it and doing the suspect verse applying, or is this some curriculum that is handling scripture that way?

It is 3, 10 week semesters of a particular curriculum that our church is using to prepare people to lead small groups, stressing personal discipline particularly as it relates to prayer and reading of Scripture. As I feel that our church (and others but this one is partly my responsibility) needs Christian apologetics, and, if I can up my game, deeper theology, I want to dot my i's and cross my t's, as it were. I could easily just stop showing up, I work at the church, but it wouldn't endanger my job or make it uncomfortable...however, I don't want to place any obstacles in the way of being able to facilitate groups later on.

The issue I am having, in particular is in one of the Bible verses, or rather the application they are using it for, and what that could mean.


John 16:24 Until now you have asked for nothing in My name. Ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be complete.
They put this verse under a "promise of answered prayer", and it belongs there, but with some warning...that they don't even allude to. What do I mean? Well, first, Jesus was speaking to the Disciples... He was talking to them of how things had been with Him present with them and how things would be once He left. He wasn't speaking to us. Now, I think we can take heart from the generalities of the promise, God will respond to personal requests without an intermediary, but we are not the Apostles.
I think most Christians who have been so for a while come to realize that not everything we ask for in Jesus' name shows up on our doorstep. No harm done, we trust that God will answer our prayers, and look out for us sometimes despite what we ask for. However, the curriculum is for, and given to, believers of all stripes. I think immense harm can come from teaching John 16:24 as normative to a new believer who doesn't have a tempered understanding of God's will.
It may seem trite, but I have heard this come up from people who have turned away from Christ. 'The Bible says God will give me whatever I ask in Jesus' name, but when I asked for a car/house/healing for my loved one it didn't happen, so the Bible must be untrue.'

There was another part where they spoke about praying and waiting on the Lord, because Jesus got up early one morning and prayed. Well, the Bible does say he got up early and prayed, but they extrapolated way past what was said, and tried to turn the extrapolation into the key point and personal application for our lives. There are passages that tell us to wait on the Lord, but they used this one instead, and overstated their case in the process... again, things which can be misleading, and, if someone bothers to think about it, can be very disillusioning to someone who is told that us church-folk are only trying to fool them.

Sounds like you've got your head screwed on right. Is the small group in a setting/atmosphere that allows for or encourages group discussion? If so, you could prove useful to others by bringing these things up. Wouldn't have to be a totally negative thing either, as you could validate the "spirit" of what the curriculum authors intend while also pointing out some potential problems if these verses are misunderstood/misapplied.

Either way, it sounds like it would be great for you to complete the course so you can be in a position to encourage critical thinking/study in others and continue to grow in it yourself. Sounds like a really great endeavor you're taking on! Hang in there! And please let us know if we can be of any help or support!

Thanks man, but really my head was screwed on, it wasn't me who made it that way...I just survived the process.
Unfortunately, the small group is set up more as a "class" than "discussion group". Also, I tend to look at things differently and react differently than most people I encounter. So, when I bring up what a lot of people consider to be minor points (but seem very important to me) I can easily come off as argumentative, contentious, holier-than-thou, and other things that are generally four letters long. ...Maybe I should say: I can miss the forest for the trees, and I don't want to take away from the forest by getting caught up on a particular leaf; at least, not for people who are built to enjoy forests. As you say, one day I plan on "facilitating" a "discussion group" for people who like trees.
(with the emphasis on small groups our church is going through, I've found it important to use a decipherable language to define what each group is... for example, a year or two ago, I started a "discussion group" for apologetics... instead, most people thought I was "teaching" a "class" on apologetics, which led to an hour of me explaining Hilbert's Grand Hotel to a bunch of confounded individuals wondering why I wasn't explaining a 6-day Creation week)

Anyway, if you understood how much I struggle to word my posts correctly, despite being a stream of consciousness writer, you might get how my clarifying a detail in a class would be different than what you suggest (and I wish I could do).
But thank you.

mikel.withers wrote:
Anyway, if you understood how much I struggle to word my posts correctly, despite being a stream of consciousness writer, you might get how my clarifying a detail in a class would be different than what you suggest (and I wish I could do).
But thank you.

That's really cool that you have that kind of self-awareness. (Not all geeks do!) I have no idea, but it may be that the Holy Spirit just wants you to endure for now so that you can be positioned for use by him later, or maybe He will bring to mind the right words of both firm truth and sensitive love at the right time, whether they are concise or wordy. Neither Paul nor Moses were good speakers, and God used them both in incredible ways because they made themselves available to him. It may or may not involve much talking right now, but I suspect God has you in the place he wants you. I'm excited for you! Can't wait to hear somewhere down the line how God might use all this!